Could giving up sugar and flour change your life? Chef AJ joins me to share her transformative journey to health through a whole food, plant-based diet, and inspires us to consider the profound effects that cutting out these addictive substances could have on our well-being. Chef AJ's four-decade commitment to this lifestyle and her insights on food addiction offer an enlightening perspective on how we approach our eating habits. From her experience, we learn the healing power of whole foods, and she challenges us to experiment with eliminating sugar, flour, and alcohol to witness their impact firsthand.
The road to recovery from addiction is a challenging one, but it's a path I've walked myself, and I open up about my own health scare that led to a complete dietary overhaul. We discuss how environments like the Optimum Health Institute can pave the way to a cleaner, more vibrant life, free from the shackles of food addiction. This episode is filled with compelling stories of individuals who've reclaimed their health by embracing nutrient-dense foods, particularly the superheroes of the vegetable world: dark, leafy greens. We delve into practical tips and celebrate the empowering sense of community that surrounds those who choose sobriety from addictive foods.
Addressing the societal pressures and the marketing trap of sugar, we take a hard look at how processed foods and sugary treats are pushed upon us, especially children, creating a cycle of dependency from a young age. We discuss how changing our food environment can make a significant difference in overcoming addictions and highlight the need for education and support systems. From the backstory of how I kicked my own health into high gear to Chef AJ's infectious enthusiasm for fitness and whole foods, we offer a candid, motivational dialogue that invites you to start your own journey towards a healthier, addiction-free lifestyle.
Florence's courses & coaching programs can be found at:
www.FlorenceChristophers.com
Connect with Florence on:
FACEBOOK | TWITTER | INSTAGRAM | YOUTUBE
Could giving up sugar and flour change your life? Chef AJ joins me to share her transformative journey to health through a whole food, plant-based diet, and inspires us to consider the profound effects that cutting out these addictive substances could have on our well-being. Chef AJ's four-decade commitment to this lifestyle and her insights on food addiction offer an enlightening perspective on how we approach our eating habits. From her experience, we learn the healing power of whole foods, and she challenges us to experiment with eliminating sugar, flour, and alcohol to witness their impact firsthand.
The road to recovery from addiction is a challenging one, but it's a path I've walked myself, and I open up about my own health scare that led to a complete dietary overhaul. We discuss how environments like the Optimum Health Institute can pave the way to a cleaner, more vibrant life, free from the shackles of food addiction. This episode is filled with compelling stories of individuals who've reclaimed their health by embracing nutrient-dense foods, particularly the superheroes of the vegetable world: dark, leafy greens. We delve into practical tips and celebrate the empowering sense of community that surrounds those who choose sobriety from addictive foods.
Addressing the societal pressures and the marketing trap of sugar, we take a hard look at how processed foods and sugary treats are pushed upon us, especially children, creating a cycle of dependency from a young age. We discuss how changing our food environment can make a significant difference in overcoming addictions and highlight the need for education and support systems. From the backstory of how I kicked my own health into high gear to Chef AJ's infectious enthusiasm for fitness and whole foods, we offer a candid, motivational dialogue that invites you to start your own journey towards a healthier, addiction-free lifestyle.
Florence's courses & coaching programs can be found at:
www.FlorenceChristophers.com
Connect with Florence on:
FACEBOOK | TWITTER | INSTAGRAM | YOUTUBE
Welcome everybody to the Kicksugar Summit. I have with me today Chef AJ, and I would like you, if you're sitting, to just take a deep breath and, if you're driving, make sure you're buckled up, because you're in for a ride. Chef AJ is an internet celebrity. She has been devoted to a whole food, plant-based diet for over 45 years. She is the host of a television series called Healthy Living with Chef AJ, which is aired on Foodie TV.
Speaker 1:She's a chef, a culinary instructor, professional speaker. She's the author of bestselling books, one of which is the Secrets to Ultimate Weight Loss a revolutionary approach to conquer cravings, overcome food addiction and lose weight without going hungry. She has a book called Unprocessed, which is just entering its 10th anniversary edition. She also has courses and programs, and she has, every single day since 2020, gone live on YouTube, facebook and Twitter sharing her passion for the topic of whole foods. And she was the executive pastry chef at Santé Restaurant, los Angeles, where she was famous for her vegan desserts that were sugar-free, oil-free, salt-free and gluten-free. And yes, there's still desserts and they still rock people's world. She is proud to say that her IQ is higher than her cholesterol, and this is the Pistor Resistance. She is celebrating her 20th year of being a whole food woman sugar-free and her 12th year of being flower-free. Welcome, chef AJ.
Speaker 2:Thank you. Yeah, if I had known about flour when I knew about sugar, I could have claimed that as well, but it's great. I celebrated 20 years off of sugar at Rancho La Puerta in Mexico with 35 other people, just in a place where they don't serve sugar. They serve food from the garden. Food is grown fruits and vegetables. Yeah, it's amazing.
Speaker 1:I haven't had a Coke slurpee in over 20 years, and one thing I didn't mention in your bio and for people who aren't familiar with you, is that Chef AJ used to be obese.
Speaker 2:Yes, yeah, because I really think that once you deal with the food addiction, the weight really does take care of itself. I didn't know about food addiction.
Speaker 1:What inspired you to actually give up flour, Like what made you.
Speaker 2:I can tell you, abe, you know the lady. She's a wonderful lady I think she's on your summit Dr Joan Iflin. I read her book Sugar and Flour how they Make Us Crazy, fat and Sick or Crazy, sick and Fat and I'm like, wow. So it's not just sugar that's the problem. It's pretty much all refined carbohydrate. Not carbohydrate I'm not talking about rice, beans and sweet potatoes but all refined, processed carbohydrates. So I think of sugar, flour and alcohol. It's all the same. As far as I'm concerned, if you have a problem with one, you probably have a problem with all of them.
Speaker 1:Right. And there's people who'll dig in there. They'll say I don't have a problem with Florence, with flour, I really don't. It doesn't seem to trigger cravings. I can't think of a good reason to give up the flour. Sugar for sure. There's no off button. I have aches and pains and headaches and I feel sick and hungover and I feel crappy and I'm diabetic and all those things. But flour, like I seem to be able to do it in moderation, why can't I? What would you say to that?
Speaker 2:Well, the thing is is, you know, I don't think you know what you have a problem with until you're willing to do a brief period or an experiment with abstinence and do without it, and then you'll know whether you have a problem. Because, first of all, people say, well, I don't have a problem with alcohol, you know, I just choose to drink every day. Well then, let's go 21 days without. Oh, I can't do that. See, the thing is is how do you know whether or not you really have a problem until you're willing to give it up for just a brief period to see how you feel? So the thing is is, you know, I look at things a couple of different ways, and one is not just does it trigger your food addiction or cause you to overeat or cause you to gain weight? But is it really a healthy food? And I look at food as healthy if it's a whole food, and that doesn't mean we don't process our food at all for it. So, for example, if somebody wants to make hummus, taking some you know beans and some lemon and some garlic and the food processor, okay, that's processed, but it's not ultra-processed, it's not refined, it doesn't have a long list of ingredients, and flour today is not the flour of our ancestors and I just feel that because I mean, if it's high caloric density, it's high glycemicness.
Speaker 2:If somebody has to have bread, I didn't. Here's the funny thing I haven't had any bread or flour in 12 years, but now I make these raw vegan wraps out of vegetables, so it's like a bread, in other words, it's. You know, I can eat it like bread. Doesn't taste exactly like bread, so I can create in my recipes missing for people that are looking for that. But you know, bread is just. I think about what's the chocolate lane that said the whiter your bread, the sooner you're dead. You know, I just feel like if it's not a whole food, then doesn't really have a place in your diet. If you're struggling with food addiction and if you're overweight my skinny husband doesn't have any addictions, he eats like a sandwich every day it's not a problem. But, like you say, if you have aches and pains, if you're not feeling your best, if you're not at the weight that you desire, you know bread is 1500 calories a pound. The whole grain that the bread was made from is 500 calories per pound.
Speaker 1:Yes, got it. So those two pieces the calorie density and the concentration of sugars are the two and I'm assuming you're gonna probably add salt in there Are the ones that really hijack our appetite. Can you talk more about that?
Speaker 2:Absolutely. I might add five, I might do a five. So a lot of people talk about, you know, being sugar-free or being flour-free. I'm actually sofas-free, s-o-f-a-s sugar, oil, flour, alcohol, salt. And you know I make a joke that if you wanna lose weight and feel your best, get off the sofa. Get off the sofa Literally and figuratively. And so of course we can't paint everybody with the same brush, and just because one is sensitive to a certain item or ingredient doesn't mean everybody is.
Speaker 2:But the thing about sugar and flour and alcohol to me, like I said, they're pretty much the same. They don't exist in nature and not in the way that people eat them. I mean the sugar in nature, it would be fruit. The flour? Well, there really is no. Is there any flour in nature? I've never seen it. Is there any alcohol in nature? Or maybe if some grapes fell off the tree and fermented? But these are highly processed foods that you don't see in nature, and I always say that.
Speaker 2:A wise man once told me that if you want to solve a problem, look to nature. And I always say if something isn't available in nature and if you can't easily make it in your own kitchen, it's probably something that you really shouldn't be consuming, or consuming that much of Like. For example, you know I don't recommend people, you know, use cocaine but the leaf that it comes from it's found in nature and sometimes people would take it as a mild stimulant and chew that leaf and it really wasn't a problem. It was like having a cup of coffee. Or the stevia leaf, for example. I mean, that's found in nature and maybe some people use it in a recipe, but the people today that use stevia aren't really taking that green leaf. They're concentrating it, they're refining it, so it's thousands of times sweeter in this little dropper full of liquid or powder and then it's no longer a whole food. That's found in nature. And so a lot of doctors that I work with they talk about the SOS-free diet, sugar oil, salt-free diet. But the reason I added flour and alcohol is because I was working with people, you know, that said, well, I'm a sugar addict, but they were still eating bread and flour and cake and they were still drinking alcohol and they were wondering well, why aren't I getting any results? I'm not losing any weight, I'm still craving sugar.
Speaker 2:All three of these things have a very high caloric density. I mean sugar and flour. They have four calories per gram, so they're not as calorically dense as, say, oil, which is nine calories a gram, but alcohol, seven calories a gram. And again, these are refined carbohydrates and, you know, are they something that's really going to add to your health or subtract for your health?
Speaker 2:I know people will find studies like oh well, you know, red wine has resveratrol. But you know what? It's not because of the wine, it's because of the grapes. And so, you know, always seek the whole food first. And I think people that are eating only whole foods, whether they're plant-based or not, aren't going to be in the same kind of trouble with their weight or addiction as people that are eating processed foods, sugar, flour, alcohol, for example. And, like I said, until you go through a period of experimentation or abstinence away from these, you really don't know if you have an addiction or your problem. Because if you can't do it, then I would say, if it whacks like a duck and walks like a duck, it's a duck. But, florence, nobody likes that word. Addiction, nobody likes it.
Speaker 1:No, no, I know I agree with you, because we all think that means I can't, I have to abstain, I have to be like an alcoholic and never drink again, and life would not be worth it. It just would hardly be worth living without all these fun foods. But what's been your experience on the other side of all your sofas?
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, my experience is that it's very difficult to to do this because you can't really I don't think I don't know Whenever overcomes an addiction. But you can certainly manage it. But I will tell you that, as difficult as it is for many people, I've never met anyone that, once they got to the other side, said boy, life was so much better when I had these hundred extra pounds, when I was diabetic, when I was drunk every night. It's so hard that you know.
Speaker 2:I hear that a lot people say I would rather die than give up blank, and that you know this isn't a court-ordered program. It's definitely a person's choice. But I will tell you that, for the people that can get to the other side, I've all heard them say that the freedom from the addiction, from being in the clutches of these constant cravings and food compulsions, feels better than they did when they were using. But when you're using, I think your judgment is clouded about Things, and so you are are going to say things like that. But to me, the fact that you're saying that means you're an addict, because who would say they would rather die, then give up whatever? That is other than an addict, I think.
Speaker 2:I think a non-addicted person wouldn't say that would they know?
Speaker 1:That totally makes sense. That's right. I mean, if you're not addicted and you can truly take it or leave it, well then please leave it, just leave it. And if it terrifies you the thought of just eating whole foods, maybe you have been hijacked. Maybe your brain lights up like a Christmas tree on these processed carbohydrates, and that there's that, there's a. There's that, there's a. There's a dynamic in play that you're, you think you're free, you think you're choosing these foods, but but there's less agency in there than you probably are willing to admit, because it's terrifying to think I've lost control. What brought you to that moment when you decided enough, no sugar, no sweeteners, no alcohol. I'm done. I mean, I know that you still kept flour in, but what was that moment?
Speaker 2:Right? Well, you know, I do always. They kept flour in is because, like most people, I thought you know, red the staff of life we break. I didn't know it was deleterious to be, not not to everyone, but to people that are sensitive to the effects of sugar and flour, which, by the way, go through the same refining process of drugs and alcohol. I did not know. Had I known, I might have been able to do it sooner, because it wasn't like you know, I what flower didn't have the same draw to me as, say, sugar? But what happened to me is I'm 63, and when I was 43 years old and 60 pounds heavier than I am now, I woke up on January 1st 2003 and I was bleeding Internally and it turned out I had what they call pre-cancerous polyps in my sigmoid colon.
Speaker 2:These are, I think they were called edematous polyps and they're the kind that, if not removed, always turned to cancer. And I have a strong family history of colon cancer. My grandmother died of it, my uncle had almost his entire colon removed, and so when I went and had, you know, the colonoscopy to see what was going on, normally they just remove the polyps during the outpatient procedure because there's, like these calipers, that kind of like, take them. Well, the doctor said that my colon was so dirty he used the word dirty In such a state of disarray that he could not get a clean shot to safely remove them. So I'd have to come back and have actual surgery, surgery under general anesthesia, where they cut into my colon and I'm no, thank you. I am afraid this is the one thing in life my fear of general anesthesia, because at the age of 19 I was having just a very minor procedure as an outpatient. I was allergic to the anesthetic and almost died. I was resuscitated in the hospital for six weeks, almost put on a ventilator. I'm definitely afraid of general anesthesia, and so for me, eating better was a much nicer option than having to have surgery, and so what I did is just to buy some time.
Speaker 2:I went to a place and I didn't. I didn't know anything about. This is so funny. I really do believe in divine intervention because I didn't know anything about this place. It's called the optimum health Institute. There's one campus in Austin, Texas, that I actually ended up going to later, but I went to the one in Lemon Grove, california, and the reason I went there is my dream was always to go to a spa and I'm really blessed that for the last 12 years I've been teaching at the best spawn the world, rancho La Puerta. But back then I certainly didn't have the money for Rancho La Puerta. But I had this magazine about discount spas and in it it was 870. I didn't. First of all, optimum health Institute is not a spa, so don't get your hopes up. It's a place of healing. But it was $875 for eight days and I'm like that's really reasonable for, like San Diego, I didn't know what it was, but luckily I'm an adventurous person and I'm like I just need to get away. I need to think.
Speaker 2:I took the train down to San Diego I was living in LA at the time and boy, where my eyes opened. It's a fabulous place, by the way, as is the True North Health Center, where you could achieve the same kind of healing, I believe. And what it is? It's different things to different people. So some people use it for detox because when I was there in July 6, 2003 which is the date that I climbed abstinence from sugar there were a lot of local football players from the San Diego team there. They were just trying to drop weight because I guess football players have to be weighed before the season or whatever. There were some famous actors and actresses there and just regular people like me from all over the world, and every Friday it was a three week program.
Speaker 2:I was only able to do one week at a time, but people would give testimonials on how eating the way, optimum health Institute teachers help them. And people were there that have overcome you know, I had no about food addiction them but people had overcome lupus, lyme's disease, brain cancer, all these diseases that we think of as incurable or difficult to cure by going on the diet. So what was the diet? Well, in their case it was raw. I don't think people have to be 100% raw to heal, but it was whole plants. They were not cooked, there was a lot of juicing, there was a lot of green vegetables, there was no sofas, there was no sugar, all oil, flour, alcohol, salt or any kind of caffeine, like coffee or stimulants or chocolate, for example. And the doctors and the nurses that run the program and it's a wonder if I haven't been there in 20, actually 18 years, because I did go back in 2005 for like a refresher but the doctors and nurses that teach the classes, which go from like 7am till 9pm.
Speaker 2:One of the principles they taught was that for any disease to exist in the body and you notice that many diseases have the word itis afterwards, like inflammation of that your body has to be in a state of inflammation, and that all the foods that I was eating, even though they were vegan, were inflammatory foods. And so if you want to heal, you have to eat anti-inflammatory foods. Whether you have a common cold or cancer, you want to be on an anti-inflammatory diet. Whole foods is found as nature, so any kind of processed food is going to be inflammatory, whether it's a vegan, processed cheese or a processed meat product. So I was doing good not eating certain things, but having Coke Slurpee every day for breakfast and Dr Pepper for lunch. I mean sugar and caffeine. You know that's not exactly health promoting.
Speaker 2:And it wasn't just the bad stuff I was eating. I was so addicted to sugar that that really was all I ate, that I wasn't eating any whole foods. I mean, I'm this vegan for ethical reasons since the age of 17, but my husband would joke you're the only vegan that doesn't eat any vegetables. I wasn't eating any fruits and vegetables. A little broccoli would sneak in here and there. I never ate fruit, because fruit God forbid, like fruit was not sweet enough to me. Now it's exceedingly sweet.
Speaker 2:So I went there and you know I'll tell you, detox is a bitch, which is why and it doesn't last long though, guys, it's not like coming off. I've never taken heroin or cocaine or alcohol. I'm sure it's not as difficult as coming off those drugs, which is why I think a lot of people, especially doctors, don't like to call it an addiction. So there's not that kind of detox. You're not going to die when you stop having sugar and flour, but there is some discomfort which only takes a few days for most people. But if you're in a place like True North or Optum Health, where you're at complete rest, you're not working, the kids aren't running around and screaming, you can do it. You just need to take that time for yourself.
Speaker 2:And I had a lot of headaches. The first, I mean having sugar is my primary source of calories for 43 years. So going to none of it, and especially no caffeine, that's a hard thing to stop to. You know, I had headaches, for you know, several days I had nausea, I had diarrhea, but the thing is, is it passed, you know, because I was being fed this organic, beautiful you know salads and juices and things that they had there. They made these seed cheeses out of sunflower seeds and sesame seeds.
Speaker 2:And you know, when I got to the other side, I mean this is the most beautiful part, I think, is I think it's Dr Iflin that talks about the com stable brain when I was in the throes of food addiction, sugar addiction, all I could think about is when I'm going to get my next fix. I would wake up in the morning, you know, I could barely open my eyes and I'm. Some days I couldn't even get to 711 safely in the car and make my husband I enabled him go get me a slurpee. And then, you know, it's just a matter of time till I need another fix. And back to 711 for a 48 ounce Dr Pepper big go and always thinking when am I going to get my fix again, when you know, and thinking about what it was going to be, and just it's eating egregious amounts of candies, cakes, cookies, pies and ice creams, albeit vegan ones. And the cool thing is is I remember I was dropped off at the.
Speaker 2:I was picked up at the train station on July 6, 2003 by a cab driver and I said take me 711. This is the thing. You know, people, when they started diet like they have like a big, big binge the night before and I'm like because I heard that it optimum health. If you're found with any contraband, you know you're going to get kicked out and you're not going to get your money back, and I'm kind of a frugal person that way. So he took me to 711. I got a coke slurpee and a Dr Pepper and it's like it's not even that enjoyable when you're trying to like drink on both at the same time just to get it over with. It was like.
Speaker 2:And then I get there at four o'clock and like the first dinner, sunday night dinner. There it's funny because they open it to the public so to give you a taste of it, and I'm like I'm like the worst thing I ever ate. I don't remember what it was, it was like some kind of salad without it was like, right, you know, really like, shoot me now. I get it. People, I get it.
Speaker 2:I've been there and that one of the reasons I don't relapse is because I don't want to have to go through that again where I don't know who doesn't taste good and all that stuff. So but when I got to the end of the week I remember by the next Saturday and when I took the train back to LA, I was just so calm, I was serene, I was peaceful, so much so that when I came home, the two dogs that I had in the time, they didn't, they didn't bark joyously or they were sniffing me. It was almost like drug sniffing dogs, like where's the drugs, and it's like I can't speak for them, but it was almost like who is this person, you know? So that was pretty profound, even though I hadn't lost weight or much weight at the time. So that was pretty cool.
Speaker 2:So, you know, all I can say is, if you do it, it's hard at first. It doesn't stay hard, especially if you get a community to support you and you follow some of the tips and tricks of the speakers on this summit. But it's a beautiful thing to have the feeling of overcoming an addiction and you know, like I say, I mean to me 20 years it's like that's amazing, cause some people can't go 20 minutes, let alone 20 days. But you know, I wish that for everybody, that they could feel what sobriety feels like, and then tell me that they would rather die without their drug. You know.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Incredible that. What's astonishing is that within seven days you got to that calm, that calm brain. That was really quick, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I think yeah, seven days it took to get to the combrain and not to have the cravings. But of course, it's not just a matter of being abstinent from the stuff. You got to put good stuff in, you know right. So I'm putting in, like the highest quality, highest nutrient fruits and vegetables that are organically grown there. I think it's important to put good things in, you know, like vegetables and you know one of the things I want to say is, regardless of what diet you follow, having a plan abstinent of sugar, I think, and possibly flower two, could help you in many ways, but you've got to eat vegetables. See, this is the hardest thing for people to understand. I know there's a big thing about fruit, which I don't agree with at all, but I can't imagine anyone telling people not to eat vegetables on any diet plan, and that's one of the best things you can eat to help combat your cravings for sugar.
Speaker 2:Not just every vegetable, because you know, things like cherry, tomatoes and cucumber and zucchini, while healthy, these are actually fruit, believe it or not. But dark green, leafy vegetables, they are magical. I hated them at first because the more acidic you are from eating this kind of standard American diet or high sugar diet, the worse. These alkaline foods that you need are going to taste, but if you just keep eating them, you know things like the bitter things like kale and Brussels sprouts. There's this magical compound in them. I didn't, I didn't discover it. It's called phylocoids. It somehow helped people with sugar cravings. They help turn off your hunger switch. They block fat absorption, and so that's why I recommend not only people eat as many vegetables as possible, as many dark green leafy, but start their day with them, whether it's in the form of a smoothie or, in my case, steamed vegetables.
Speaker 2:There is something about vegetables that is enormously helpful. It's just that the more a person eats junk food and sugar and flour, the less likely they're going to want to eat vegetables or like them. And again, this has to do with this concept, which I talk about a lot in my work, called caloric density, because the more calorically concentrated the calories in a food, the more dopamine is released, which is why people like processed food and animal products better than whole plant foods, because they are so much higher in caloric density. Where vegetables are 100 calories per pound, oil is 4,000 calories per pound. What's going to give you more dopamine?
Speaker 2:But if you can just train yourself, even if all you eat all day is Big Macs, if you could just train yourself that every morning you're going to eat a pound of dark, green, leafy vegetables. First of all, you may not want that Big Mac, but it's going to do something remarkable for your health and I can't explain it, but I see it all the time. And then when I see people relapse from one of the first happen I, you know, I stopped eating vegetables. You got to eat vegetables. Everybody has to do kids. You know I love Dr Nicola Vina because she talks a lot about this, about how you know it's. I mean, it's pretty easy to get people and kids to eat fruit because it's sweet and delicious, but you've got to start that vegetable eating at a young age.
Speaker 2:And I didn't look what happened to me. I weighed almost 200 pounds with the beginning of colon cancer. That's what happens when you eat a fiberless diet. And think about it. Sugar has no fiber. A flower has, maybe some. Usually it's added back in. But again, if everything you eat has fiber and water together and tacked, you're I don't want to say you're home free, but you're on the, on a good trajectory.
Speaker 1:And that's been my personal experience with leafy greens, that they I know. I know I've been in this space long enough to know that there are people who, for some reason or another, don't process vegetables very well, excruciating pain, ibs, whatever I get, that there's medical exceptions, but over time, as a digestion heals, I've heard that they can reintroduce them and that it does make a difference for energy, for mood, for cravings so many good things, and actually the only true source of minerals, or the major source of minerals from our diet comes from vegetables.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. And you know I personally have or have struggled with IBS. So I would say to that person get a consultation with a really good GI doctor or do something with one of the true north doctors, because I believe that there's always a way for people to eat vegetables. Maybe they can't eat raw vegetables, but most people can eat vegetables that are very well steamed, that are pureed, maybe in the form of a smoothie or a soup. So I wouldn't I wouldn't sell yourself short and just say I have this. Therefore, I cannot eat vegetables. There's always some way to include them, even if it's in the form of like a green powder or something, but I think that not eating vegetables is a mistake. I believe you've had Dr Furman on your summit before and he always says if you don't like vegetables, you better live close to a hospital.
Speaker 1:Wow, powerful line. Tell us about the tips and tricks, then. What are some of the best wisdom that you have to share about how to achieve what you've achieved? 20 years being a whole food woman well, at least no sugar. 12 years, you know, whole food woman.
Speaker 2:You know I have to say this, but it seems that the most of the people I've worked with they have to hit some kind of a rock bottom to make a change. You know, because they always, oh, I'm going to do it someday. You know I'm going to do it someday. Well, I didn't have a choice because to me, you know, having surgery and being under the threat of a surgeon's knife was enough fire under my butt to finally change my diet. And it's unfortunate that most people do wait, usually until the 11th hour, you know, until they're diagnosed with diabetes, or before they have to go on insulin, or because, or when their weight is such an issue that they, you know they finally have to do something about it.
Speaker 2:So I think the first thing is is you have to really want it. You know, I remember this has nothing to do with food, but I had a wonderful acting teacher 40 years ago and people would say her name was Joan Darling. And do I have it? Do I have it Meaning? Do I have what it takes to be a big star, like some of these people that are in your class? And she'd go, it depends, and we'd go. What depends on what? Well, how bad, do you want it? And so that's the thing. I think you have to really want it.
Speaker 2:And so when they talk about this thing called your why the why that makes you cry. You have got to want it for yourself, not because your husband tells you you need to lose weight or because the doctor tells you you need to lose weight. You have really got to want it. Because if you don't really want this for yourself, it's going to be hard. But you have to have this compelling reason to do it every day.
Speaker 2:And you know, looking good for your daughter's wedding or for your 40th high school reunion that is a very short term. Why it has to be bigger than that. And so my why is I will do anything to not, you know, have general anesthesia or surgery. That's to me, that's the biggest, scariest thing in the world. And so you have to figure that out for yourself. Why do you want it? And you know some people don't, some people just don't want it bad enough, and the people that I've seen success they really, really wanted it. They really, really wanted it. So you have to want it and you have to figure out why. And until you find that internal reason, I don't know if you're going to be successful, because then it will just be a diet and you'll do it for a little bit and you won't stick to it.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. What are some of the big? Why's that? You've seen that stick.
Speaker 2:Well, usually it involves children and grandchildren. So that's why I haven't worked with a lot of young people. But it's hard because they're so young, like and again, the youngest person I think I've ever had in a program was 19 or 20, because I think most of us know that when we're young we feel like we're invincible.
Speaker 2:We're never going to die, you don't think I don't think most teenagers or 20-year-olds feel so. They feel that they have a long time of living and partying before it catches up with them. So most people I know they're compelling. Why was usually to be around for their family to take care of, because mostly I work with women. So to be around for their family, but especially to see to walk their daughter down the aisle, to be able to play with their grandchildren, not on oxygen or from a wheelchair, those are the whys that I have seen be very successful for people like even people trying to quit smoking. It seems like those are the whys that I see a lot of times. It's not usually just so I can fit into a bikini and look good on social media. Those I mean.
Speaker 2:Well, maybe somebody's why, and that's a good enough why if it's your why but a lot of times for people when they do get on medicine for lifestyle diseases, I think a lot of people they maybe have not seen Forks Over Knives or read the China Studying, they don't realize that a lot of these not a lot of these, I would say all of these lifestyle diseases like hypertension, heart disease, type two diabetes, autoimmune disease and even certain cancers are a result of lifestyle, result of what you put in your mouth, and that you can actually not only prevent them by eating a whole food diet, but even reverse them. And so for a lot of people, they'll go on these medicines and they'll actually feel worse, not better. And so when I think feeling good is a really wonderful motivator, which is why, if you can get to a place like a True North Health Center or an inpatient place I mean online programs are wonderful, don't get me wrong, but there still could be too much temptation in your home where you're with like-minded people and you're all detoxing together. When you can get to that place of that calm, stable brain or feel how good you feel, it can.
Speaker 2:Until you start to feel good, you don't always know how bad you felt because a lot of people don't realize you get used to, you neuro-adapt to all the aches and pains in your body. You start to think that that's normal. But then, when you start to feel better, you're like, wow, I like this better. And so sometimes, just doing a 21 day experiment, if you can off these toxic and I say toxic because I believe they are foods, I don't believe they're foods when you start to feel better. That can be a motivator to do it or to continue doing it, because yeah.
Speaker 1:You have the lived experience. Your body's starting to say, oh, oh, I was wrong to fight you on this. I do feel better. I mean, it becomes your ally. I have found it takes usually longer than 21 days, but for you it's only seven, which is enough, well no, the reason I said 21,.
Speaker 2:Listen, I think it'd take three months, to be honest, four months on people. But the thing is is a lot of people can't think that that far off. That's what procrastination is something that human beings do because they think, well, I'll just, I may not have to do it. The reason I say 21 days is because I think if you give people a small, you wanna renew it after day 22,. But if you say to them you can never have sugar or flour or alcohol again, they're like forget it. And so three or four months seems like an eternity to people, especially people that struggle with addiction. But the reason I like 21 days is because there's a lot of programs that are 21 days PCRM, kickstart, for example. But also because I know people that were addicts, that could still, in the name of religion, do something for Lent.
Speaker 2:That was difficult. I've seen people that smoke, that have given up cigarettes for that religious period, or given up chocolate or given up alcohol. So I figured, if you can do something for 40 days, maybe you could do it for 21 days. And of course you're right, it's probably not long enough, especially if somebody has been addicted to these foods for a long time, but I think it could give them some good information to see if they're gonna feel better. You know, I think part of the reason that people struggle so much is because there's just so much dissension in the medical world about whether or not food is an addiction, which is why I really respect people like Dr Vera Tarmann, who is a medical doctor who runs an inpatient treatment center that really looks at it in the lens of an addiction. And of course we're not saying that if you're addicted to heroin or methamphetamine, that that's not more serious.
Speaker 2:But what's difficult about food as an addiction is you have to eat. You don't have to take hard line drugs or alcohol or smoke, you don't even have to drink coffee, but you gotta eat sometime and you're faced with this decision. You know one, two, three or more times a day, and you live in a social environment that makes it almost impossible to succeed. You know, I think about this story that I used to hear from a gentleman his name is the Reverend OC Smith, and you might I don't know if you're old enough to remember a song God didn't make Little Green Apples that he made famous in the 60s, and he would talk about how, when a fisherman catches crabs in a bucket, you know to eat them. Some of the crabs are smart enough to figure out if they crawl on the other crabs. They can actually crawl out to the bucket to their freedom, but the other crabs just pull them back down to their death.
Speaker 2:And unfortunately, that's what people's social environment is often like, because I think not only does misery like company, addicts like company, and if you're in a family setting or a social setting where everybody else is continuing the behavior and you're the odd man out, it can be difficult, it can be very difficult to change. I know people that have stopped drinking not to be holier than now, because maybe they had like a little heart thing and their doctor said you can't drink alcohol anymore. And I've heard so many people say well, we lost all our friends because we're not funny anymore, because we can't drink anymore. And it's the same thing if you're eating crap food, everybody does it.
Speaker 2:Hey why are over 70% of Americans overweight and more than half of them obese? If it's not an addiction, what is it? Our genes haven't changed that quickly. So it's really like Dr Frank Sabatino says is food is the only addiction that you can just do in public. You can do it at your desk at work. You can do it at your desk in school. I mean they encourage it. Look at all the crap they bring at school, birthday parties and at soccer games and if you're in a God forbid, you raise your kid without sugar. What a terrible parent you are. You're denying them. So I think the whole conversation has to change. I mean, the food they serve at school is deplorable. People are like.
Speaker 2:I love the work of Dr Nicolavino. Talks about what the mother eats when she's pregnant is gonna affect what their preferences are. It's just a tough conversation because everybody just because everybody's doing it doesn't mean it's normal. There was a time in human history where there was child labor and there probably still is in parts of the world, or when everybody thought the world was flat. Just because everybody's doing it doesn't mean it's right and that you should do it. Dare to be different, never be afraid to be part of the minority when the minority is right.
Speaker 1:No, my gosh, totally. And when you think about the fact, if sugar in fact is addictive, it is an addictive substance and every lab that has ever studied it, starting with Dr Nicolavino, and has been replicated around the world hundreds of times, peer-reviewed medical journals have reported on it and they will say there's no difference between how lab animals, mice and rats respond to morphine and cocaine and sugar Same, they withdraw the same. It appears to be an opiate or a substance of potential use and abuse, like any other drug that we study in our labs. So let's say sugar is addictive. It's a known addictive substance, or at least some of us know it's an addictive substance. That is the only addictive substance that we allow children to have exposure to. We protect them from vaping, restricted movies, porn, hopefully, alcohol, gambling. We protect children from addictive substances. This is the only substance that we do not protect children from.
Speaker 2:Ooh, not only don't we protect them, but we addick them at an early age and we make them customers for life with all the like. For example, if you've ever gone to a regular grocery store and you think about eye level and shelf space, right, you know those processed cereals aren't up high or down low, they're right at the level where the mom pushing the basket, where that kid can see it, and have a fit and cry if they don't get their sugar frosted, whatever with the toy. And then the marketing to children and the commercials. You know I remember, even as young as I was in the 60s, you know, seeing commercials that when I think back now, wow, they really were targeting it to children, you know, because they weren't during, like, wasn't during 60 minutes, it was during. You know the Flintstones, you know during the cartoons, and so, yeah, they are marketing it to children too.
Speaker 2:So it's hard because you know, americans eat you know what, last time I checked 92% of their calories from animal products and processed food, less than 10% from fruits and vegetables and something like 67 to 72% processed food, some people probably 100%. That's why I don't like that we call it food. You know, I think it was. Is it Michael Pollan or someone says we should call it food like substances or a science experiment, because just because you can eat it doesn't mean you should. And I mean, if you really go to a supermarket and take out the processed food, you know what you're left with is the produce section. I mean, it's just incredible how much processed food there is.
Speaker 2:And I remember growing up in the 60s. You know things like tang and space food sticks and pop tarts and figurines and you know these things were. You know what they were. Tasty, of course, because they know how much sugar, fat and salt are put into. You know to hijack your taste buds and addict your brain. Chemistry. And I think if people would get educated on the science reading books like sugars and flowers, how they make us crazy, fat and sick, the end of overeating by the former head of the FDA, dr David Kessler, or Hooked, or Salt, sugar and Fat, how the food giants hooked us by investigative journalist, pulitzer Prize winning author Michael Moss. When I read these books I'm like, wait a minute. So they did this on purpose. They knew this. They're, you know, making me a like. I got so mad I just stopped eating processed food.
Speaker 2:More is a political statement Like I didn't want my money to go to that. But again, even people that want that, it's really hard. Parents are busy it's easy, you know. You know, just because it's quicker to go through the drive-through, you think the dollar menu's cheaper. But if you look at the consequences of the dialer menu, like $400 for your diabetes medicine you know it's not really cheaper. But it's just so pervasive.
Speaker 2:And you know I'm really blessed having lived in California my whole life, which is a pretty healthy state when you compare it to like I have friends that live, like you know they call it the stroke belt or the bacon belt, where this conversation would be like either a laugh at or not even listen to. But I think people you know, with summits like yours and even mine, maybe some people are starting to wake up. So the first step is get the education and then you need to take some kind of action on it. But even then it's hard. I mean I know people that I've known like I can think of people that came to my programs and like they knew it and they could recite it but they couldn't do it and then sometimes 10 years later they were a ha moment or you know, a lot of times it always seems, you know people don't just wake up and say you know, when I learned on Florence's summit, that's true, I think I'm gonna stop eating crap.
Speaker 2:Usually something has to happen to light a fire under your butt, and so a lot of times, like in cases of some of my female clients, it's like you know their husband had an affair or something. There's something that happens that makes them kind of like look at their whole life and when they do that, they you know, and then they want to get better and look better and feel better. It doesn't matter a person's why, but I think you do have to have a compelling reason, because I think just wanting to be healthy and have healthy children should be compelling enough. Where people seem to need some kind of something, a lot of times external happen Like I don't know what your.
Speaker 2:I remember yeah, I do remember your recovery story. You had migraines, you did not feel well. So sometimes people have to feel worse before they feel better. And you know, I like to quote my mentor, dr Ellen Goldhammer what's it gonna take? How fat and sick do you want to be? Even then, the longer I'm in this space, the more I'm just amazed at how hard this is for so many people, not just to do it long-term because we understand abstinence is a big commitment but just to even take that first step.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, when I think about the social injustice of what's happening with food marketing, like you were talking about, to children, and the false marketing and the way that they're designed, engineered to hit our best point for profit. Governments are failing us, for sure they are, but I think, ultimately, governments are usually the last place where policies get put into play. They follow the lead of society and if this food culture is gonna turn around, it's gonna be because of women. Absolutely, we are dropping the ball. It's our responsibility to feed our children healthy, whole foods. It's our responsibility. We are the ones serving them as nurses in hospitals and daycares and school, as teachers.
Speaker 1:We are so embedded, we've been so co-opted into this food culture malfunction that makes companies billions of dollars and we don't see it and it's not gonna change. If we're waiting for the government to come up with new policy, we're gonna wait till our children are fat, sick and dead and it's not gonna change. It's women's. This is our, it's our responsibility. It just is Women against drunk driving, women against added sugars. It's the same movement and the African-American community did not get the vote. Women did not get the vote without years, years of people working really hard to fight for the rights and if we want a food culture, that's just, we have to fight for it. But first time we need to get you free, get you unhooked, get you awakened, get you to understand this is a genuine addiction and that recovery is possible and, my God, life on the other side is better. What other tips do you have for people? Chef Edgy is if they start in on this path and start to become whole food men and women.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, one is get some kind of support. I mean because I feel like if you could have done it on your own you probably would have already. And support can be. I mean it can be a group, like Florence has programs, I have programs it can be a coach, can be a one-on-one thing and you can get some kind of an accountability partner. It doesn't you don't even have to necessarily spend money to have somebody that you're accountable through text or emails or daily phone calls. But I feel that most people, unless they're just these die-hard introverts, need some kind of support or system just to know that they're not alone. And I think reading some of the books that we mentioned can be very helpful, because people just really fight this term addiction. So if you don't like the word addiction, call it something else preference or inability to stop. I think if we could have a different name for it, like Dr Tarmann says, maybe we should call it dopamine deficiency disorder. It might be easier on some people because- or dependency, dependency, sugar dependency.
Speaker 2:Broccoli preference, you know, or something like that. You know it could help people like Production. Oh my God, sorry about that. That's so good, I fuck. Do you ever have your phone just start playing? It's funny, because it just started playing a book, so I stopped it.
Speaker 1:I'm so sorry, it's okay.
Speaker 2:The book that started playing is on this topic, so I apologize. Maybe you can edit that out. So you know, I would say the ABCs of support, accountability, a buddy, a coach, so it can be a person, it can be a program, you know, and I just wish you could just feel how good it feels to be free from addictive substances long enough that you might wanna stay and do it longer. But again, I think a person's environment is very important to a person's recovery because, like I said I've always said, at least in terms with weight loss, but this I think would apply for food addiction as well If it's in your house, it's in your mouth, and so I know that there are people that think that they should be able to coexist, you know, with these addictive substances, and maybe they can. But, like you know, early in a person's recovery, I think it's really hard for that substance that they've been relying on and crave to be in front of them, you know, 24 hours a day. Maybe later on we can experiment and try to add it back in or have it in your house. I think people need to have conversations with their family and explain. You know that this is difficult for them and I would really appreciate it if you know you didn't bring the pepperoni pizza home and the french fries and the box of donuts, because I'm really trying hard. The thing is is often addicts, you know, are living with other addicts, and since people don't even believe in addiction, they're not, you know. If you don't believe in addiction, you think your husband that's eating the same way is gonna believe in it. Education can really help, I think it's.
Speaker 2:I don't have the answer for everyone other than just do an experiment, give yourself a period of time to see what it feels like off these substances and for people that cannot even go a period of time without it. Then maybe really think about going to a place like that. I mentioned Optimum Health, true North. I'm sure there's other places where you can just, you know, calm your brain and see what it's like without it. I wish I could wave a magic wand and eliminate the detox period for people, or let them know, you know, see into what their future could look like free of addictive substances.
Speaker 2:But you know it's like why, look? Why would all of us be saying the same thing that abstinence is bliss? You know, I mean like it's not a conspiracy, it's just that all of us whether it's you know, I know people that were alcoholics we just all are living better lives without these substances that are destroyed, that destroy lives and families. And the thing about food addiction, I think, is, unlike other addictions that can kill people quickly, they kill them slowly and insidiously, through excess weight and diseases that do not need to occur. And you know so when you look at the death certificate. You know, like for my brother, for example, you know it said pancreatic cancer. But was it the fact that even though he's like the smartest guy I knew, graduated number one at Princeton, was a medical doctor but he couldn't control his food addictions? That's never on the death certificate you know?
Speaker 1:Wow, I didn't know that about your brother.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I come from a family of morbidly obese people and so I am not. You know, when people say, oh, you're so thin, believe me, this is not genetics. This is hard. Well, I don't even think it's hard work anymore. It was hard work initially, but yeah so. And also I want people to know that if you are addicted to any degree of these foods or if you find yourself overweight or obese, it's not your fault. Genetics plays a huge role something like 80% but now that you're learning things about things you can't control, it's kind of your. If you want to improve, it's your responsibility to make some changes, as difficult as they may be.
Speaker 1:No one else is going to talk about salt. What is your concern with salt and caffeine? Those are the two, oh yeah.
Speaker 2:Right? Well, that's the other thing. And in these artificial sweeteners it's like you know. This is the thing. Have you ever noticed that addicts really like to bargain? They love to bargain.
Speaker 2:And if you think about in hardline drugs, I mean, how is it going to fit If somebody goes into beddy for alcoholism and says, ok, I'm going to give up vodka, you know, I'm just going to drink beer. Or I'm just going to drink, you know, alcohol on Sundays, or I'm just going to put it in a smaller cup? They're going to laugh at you because in drugs it is pretty much all or nothing. And I know there's this idea of harm reduction. But my feeling is, whether it's smoking or alcohol or sugar, if you could have cut down, wouldn't you have tried it already? Was it really successful? Because I think when you keep any amount of addictive substances in, it just bangs on your brain. So you have to have more and more and more. That's why I feel like the best amount of of any addictive substance for something that you're addicted to is none. But people forget about it, except for Dr Joe Niflund, who talks about fat and salt. People forget about salt and you know, I think salt can be a real addiction for people, especially these people. You see that either you serve them food or they order food at a restaurant and they're putting salt on it before they've even tasted it. You know, salt is a learned preference, the only actually every taste preference is learned. The only taste preference inherent in the human being is breast milk, which is supposed to be our natural food for the first couple years of our life.
Speaker 2:I was raised without eating salt because my father was 50 when I was born he had already suffered a heart attack and they put him on a no salt diet so I didn't know any difference. So the food tasted OK to me. But if you're eating a lot of salt and you add less or none, it's not going to taste good. But what people don't realize is yes, you need sodium, it's an essential nutrient without which you die. But if you're eating a whole food diet and enough calories, you're going to get enough sodium. You're going to get at least 500 milligrams a day just from the food. Things like celery and chard and greens are very, very high in sodium and so I'm not telling people they can never eat salt, but they should never cook with it because it dissipates. If you're going to add it, you add it at the top. But people that suffer from food addiction I often find that salt is also a problem for them, and salt is a very powerful appetite stimulant because they've done studies that show when you eat salt, when you salt your food, you eat about 11 percent more calories, usually from fatty foods, because it is a very powerful appetite stimulant.
Speaker 2:Sugar, oil and salt Dr Goldhammer talks about are not foods. They're not found in nature, not in any concentrated form, but they fool the brain satiety mechanisms that cause us to overeat. And so salt, it's like a yin-yang thing. Somebody has something sweet and then they want something salty. Somebody has something salty, they want something sweet. And the thing is, if you're eating processed food, you're eating so much salt that you can't even taste. There is more salt in bread where it's hidden than even on potato chips where it's on the surface. So I always say if you're going to use salt, use it judiciously in the afters, and we should call chefs the after as the finish, where the taste was of your tongue, it can taste it. But I find that when people stop eating so much salt they can also more easily stop eating so much sugar. I think they're connected. But most people, except for Dr Goldhammer and Dr Ferman, esther and Sabatino Oviere, the doctors, and I know they feel like salt is just not such a big deal and it may not be for everybody. But again, until you take it out do you really know if it's a problem for you, because everybody thinks it's not, until they have a period of abstinence.
Speaker 2:I think that caffeine and alcohol are terrible for people with addictions Because I think anytime you have an addiction it doesn't matter. Don't have any other addictive substances. You know, it's funny when people would come to my program and they're still smoking. I'm thinking I think that's probably more important first. Let's get you off of that instead of worrying about your weight. The thing about caffeine and I wish I've got to see if I can find you the blog post Dr Linda Carney did an amazing lecture about is either 17 or 19 reasons why caffeine makes it hard for you to lose weight.
Speaker 2:But the thing about caffeine is it's a drug, it's not a food. I mean, the coffee bean is found in nature, but the way you make it it's. You know this is again processed food. It's a highly addictive central nervous system stimulant. It has a 17 hour half-life, so that cup of coffee you've had in the morning can affect your ability to have deep sleep at night. And when you don't sleep well, your eating is not usually as good, because we know what it's like when people are sleep deprived or don't get enough deep sleep and the fact that you cannot function in the morning without it. To me most people well, that to me smacks of an addiction.
Speaker 2:I find that people that have the coffee habit, even if they're not adding sugar to it, which most people do, or coffee mate dairy, can be a very big addiction for people. They tend to have slumps in the afternoon, that they tend to have sugar cravings in the afternoon, that when they get rid of the coffee they don't have anymore. So my feeling is is addiction is addiction? Let's just get rid of all of it. You know if you can and see how you feel, and I think we live in a world that's just so full of it that we don't even see it anymore as an addiction because we see it as normal.
Speaker 2:And those of us that don't do it, a worker decides like what's the matter with you? You don't drink alcohol, you don't drink coffee, you don't eat sugar. We're considered the pains and the asses. But hey, I feel great. You know, at 63, I'm functioning better, my mind is sharp and I don't ever want to go back to. You know the way I was. I moved swings and yelling and I remember when I used to go to 7-Eleven and the machine was broke sometimes it was I would just scream at the clerk like who does that?
Speaker 2:Like oh, I'm gonna call the corporate, you know, because I had to get my fix. There's nothing worse than that feeling of the constant craving and having to have. I don't like that feeling. I didn't like it. So you know, if you like it, then keep doing what you're doing.
Speaker 2:But I think that there's a better life in store for many people that are willing to try. And again, when I say try, it's you may have some slips and slides, or what I like to call snacks and ends, because it's not easy and the trajectory of success is not usually a straight line. It might be for some people. You're going to have, you know, hills and valleys, but but if you just I believe that if you just Willie Nelson always said the definition of success is getting up one more time than you get knocked down I think there's hope for a lot of people. And that's what's so great about these summits is people get pumped up, they get inspired, they see people that have been successful.
Speaker 2:I mean, you know I love watching success stories rich role. You know the, the famous podcaster you know was an alcoholic and also a junk food eater too, and he believes in food addiction. You know, surround yourself with this kind of you know programming more than like your TV program. I mean, that's another thing. I think the thing that helped me is I haven't had television in five years.
Speaker 2:And I think I think that has helped me stay in recovery. I mean, I do have, you know, netflix and stuff, but I haven't seen regular TV in almost six years now and I think I think that can help recovery, as can exercise. That's the other thing. Most people, regardless of their weight or level of addiction no, last time I checked was it like 6% of people in America regularly exercise. It's like nobody, I mean, that will help you so much.
Speaker 2:So when it's difficult for you to make these healthier food choices, there's something like almost magical about exercise. The problem is, too many people use it as like a punishment for binging or overeating or for weight loss. No, no, no, I mean, exercise isn't going to help you lose weight. There's research that shows it will help you maintain your weight loss. But what exercise does is it floods your brain with these feel good chemicals, which is what you're doing with the food and the alcohol to medicate with, and it just makes it easier to stay on a, on a, on a sobriety path or on a healthy eating path, especially if you do it first thing in the morning, because it just it just sets you up for the day to be successful. So I think making exercise, I would say make exercise and vegetable eating non-negotiables. I think those are two places to start.
Speaker 1:Incredible. Tell me a bit about your exercise. What does it look like? What do you do it?
Speaker 2:looks like the spin bike right there. So I am. I'm somebody that doesn't have a lot of time, so I can't. I'm not that I can't, but I choose not to drive to the gym, look for a parking space, wait for the class. So finally, years ago, Dr Lyle said just buy a bike. So I bought a used spin bike, not even a fancy peloton. It's called Kaiser K E I S E R, and I wake up in the morning, usually, between you know, around six ish.
Speaker 2:First thing I do is walk my dog and it's not a vigorous walk because she's 12. It's more of a stroll. And then I get on that bike for one hour. I do it at a higher level, but I'm doing it standing because I get a better workout. And then it's just you know. I find, like you know, once you exercise it, you it kind of improves your self esteem, you feel proud of yourself for doing it, and so if you've done something like that, you're not going to then go eat a bunch of crap food. That wouldn't make any sense. So if you can, if you can start doing that and you can get a buddy for that, it doesn't have to be somebody on your eating path, but even a neighbor hey, you want to take a walk?
Speaker 2:And a lot of people say, well, I can't exercise because of my ability or disability. There is some even people in wheelchairs. I have a friend who's a famous personal trainer. There's something that everyone can do as long as you're breathing. There is something you know I go for physical therapy because I injured my hip and it's in the water and I see people that are much worse off with me, like they've had strokes and all, and I'm just saying there's. You know, people like to make excuses. There is something that everyone can do. You may need that physical therapist to get you started, but I do believe that there is some form of exercise, even if it's just walking in a shallow pool, that everyone can do. But you have to be committed and it's hard, let's face it.
Speaker 2:If this was easy, everybody would have done it right.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm, totally, Absolutely Amazing. Is there any fun or words you'd like to share with us today on the topic of sugar, sugar addiction whole foods.
Speaker 2:I would say that if addiction isn't working for you and if moderation isn't working for you, give abstinence a try. What have you got to lose?
Speaker 1:Thank you so much, chef AJ. I have twice in this interview teared up Aw, overwhelmed with love. Really, I love the way you word things. I love your passion, I love your integrity. Thank you so much for this interview. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 2:Well, thank you for your work and thank you for this summit and really best of luck to everyone. Best of health, you know. I just want to say that just because you can't do everything doesn't mean you can't do anything. Even small incremental changes, when done over time, can lead to huge results. So just do something.
Speaker 1:Thanks again, thank you.